Talk:Shrine of Order

Is "religion" the right word?
From what I remember, Ultima tended to avoid the use of the word "religion", except to express distance from it. In U4, Spirituality was explicitly made distinct from religion. According to Notable Ultima (the books, transcripts aren't available) there are some religious sounding terms like "holy fathers", but the only mention of "religion" on that page is somewhat tongue-in-cheek.

Yes, there are several organizations across Britannia, Serpent Isle and Pagan that have all the trappings of religion, but Origin doesn't seem to like that word. It's my opinion we shouldn't use it in this context. AngusM 21:59, May 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * I didn't find the mention of religion in Our Great Leaders to be at all tongue-in-cheek. The Ophidian practices are actually one of the few things in Ultima that I would find appropriate to label as religion. The Serpents were worshipped as deities and had according doctrines to be followed, the Hierophants acted as spiritual leaders and were specifically referred to as such, and of course there are the numerous shrines and rituals that were all created in the name of the Serpents.


 * I do agree with you that Origin generally distanced itself from the concept of religion in Ultima, but in this case I wouldn't find it objectionable if the term were to remain. --Terilem 09:49, May 19, 2010 (UTC)


 * There are other mentions, the word "religious" is used twice in the book The True Believers. Given that no one has continued this argument, and that there are reasons to keep the word, I'll remove the banner. If more discussion is to be had, the banner can be re-added.--Sega381 19:03, July 17, 2010 (UTC)

Why '"war"'?
Why is "war" in quotes? The way it is worded there it sounds like it wasn't a decisive victory. If that's the case maybe the word should be replaced by a small description (maybe up to 5 words). Whatever the case, it needs edited. AngusM 22:07, May 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * Actually, a preferred wording occurred to me, so I think what's there now is good enough. AngusM 22:15, May 17, 2010 (UTC)